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Some lawmakers want $12 trillion US debt higher on agenda

WASHINGTON — In the past, members of Congress never have been particularly eager to remind the public that they regularly vote to raise the ceiling on the national debt, which now exceeds $12 trillion.
1. Comment by CHRIS J. (HORQUILLA) — November 29,2009 @ 1:03AM
Ratings:   -2 +18

Neither the Democratic party nor the Republican party are the cause of the economic crisis that now confronts our nation. Both parties are equally responsible for the crisis in which we now find ourselves. This problem has been festering for three to four decades and only now has become so serious that policies once used to temporarily resolve it are no longer effective in dealing with it. These policies have only been designed to treat the symptoms of our problems, but do not effectively deal with the underlying causes of our nation's serious economic crisis.

A prime example of the stagnant mindset is the our federal government's recent economic stimulus program, which only offers Americans false hope. How does trillions of dollars of unsustainable government spending over an indefinite period into the future solve our nation’s economic crisis? It only increases our national debt at a time when it was our reliance on credit and debt that precipitated the problem in the first place. It’s like throwing gasoline on a fire in an effort to extinguish the flames. Does it really make any sense to substantially increase the debt that will have to be paid by future generations? The truth be told, current economic recovery efforts are just a continuation of an ongoing Ponzi scheme, which has been promoted by politicians of both political parties over the last several decades. They have told and continue to assure the citizens of this nation that we can have it all without regard to who is actually going pay for these excesses when the bills finally become due. None of our leaders have the political courage or will to do what is necessary to balance federal budget.

The real cause of America's economic crisis is our inability with live within our means. These problems are of our own making. Real solutions to the current economic crisis will require substantial changes in how America conducts it’s business at home and abroad. There are no quick, painless solutions to these problems. Any sustainable solution to our economic problems must substantially reduce our nation’s huge trade deficit. That would result in the injection of hundreds of billions of dollars into the U.S. economy, which would otherwise be diverted overseas. In order to accomplish this task, we need to restore the wealth producing sectors of our economy, which will allow our nation to once again create the wealth it requires for sustainable economic growth. Until our representatives in Washington make a concerted effort to restore the wealth producing sectors of our national economy, the problems that currently plague our nation’s economy will only worsen.

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2. Comment by Jeffrey H. (flibber) — November 29,2009 @ 5:11AM
Ratings:   -2 +11

...at some point, it will have negative economic consequences.

It's a miracle that such a point hasn't been reached yet. Some say that it will occur when the debt reaches an undefined percentage of the GDP. Perhaps when China stops buying our debt forcing our interest rates to rise fueling both inflation and stagnation. Maybe when the printed fiat money supply reaches a critical point. Maybe when the U.S. dollar is no longer accepted as the world's reserve currency and the Arabs and Chinese demand payment in bullion, Euros or other exchange. Whenever, at such point a cascade of events should make the last meltdown seem like a mere blip.

Then there's the possibility that the U.S. can keep pulling wealth out of the air because of our unique position as the world's indispensible market. If our dollar isn't accepted there will no longer be the foundational capital with which the developing countries are fueling their development and economies. Is there a limit to how much wealth can be built on illusion and voodoo? The idea can make economics fun.

Either economic theories will be revised or once again hot air will prove to be a poor foundation that can sustain lift for only so long.

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3. Comment by Moris D. (Moris D) — November 29,2009 @ 6:23AM
Ratings:   -22 +7

President Obama inherited that debt from shrub

Shrub drove us broke trying to kill Saddam because Saddam tried to kill Shrub's daddy big bucks.

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4. Comment by mike o. (thud68) — November 29,2009 @ 6:35AM
Ratings:   -5 +17

...and Obama and his Democrat buddies had nothing to do with it? I think NOT...

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5. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 7:06AM
Ratings:   -2 +14

3. Comment by Moris D. (Moris D) —

President Obama inherited that debt from shrub

Shrub drove us broke trying to kill Saddam because Saddam tried to kill Shrub's daddy big bucks.

-- Enough is enough, yes President Obama inherited a debt. When does the President accept responsibilities for increasing what he inherited

Both parties got us in this mess because we the people have become an entitlement driven society and they use the power of incumbency to buy our votes

I heard this on one of the news channel, say no to carreer politicians

Check out this site: http://usdebtclock.org/

The numbers are staggering

Power corrupts, no to incubments and to career politicians

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6. Comment by Joe S. (Joe Saba) — November 29,2009 @ 7:19AM
Ratings:   -6 +13

as our greedy and immoral politicians - O'mama is the biggest one --

we the mules are about to get slaughtered

of course it is our own fault for electing these IDI*TS

just remember sheeple that until we follow moral principles to expect nothing but the worst

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7. Comment by Phillip D. (pdavid) — November 29,2009 @ 7:23AM
Ratings:   -14 +5

mike o.

You obviously need some facts on the current federal deficit, because by far (not even close!) the republican Bush is responsible for the current debt, not Obama. Read the news , read the CBO numbers , and you'd know:

- 41 percent, or $245 billion, came in the form of the TARP - thanks, George Bush

- 18 percent, or $110 billion, is for increases in Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid - due to long-standing demographic trends (we're getting older)

- 8 percent or $51 billion is unemployment benefits - thank you George Bush

- 18 percent or $108 billion, came from Stimulus money - thank you, Obama

- the rest? about 15% of the deficit is due to decreased tax revenue gov't took in. Bad economy, and huge tax cuts= less revenue -- thank you, George Bush

So don't be blaming huge deficit on Obama and the Democrats. The numbers tell the true story. We're still living with the mess Bush gave us. It's going to take quite a while to clean it up and restore the books to fiscal sanity.

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8. Comment by sandra f. (azrabbit) — November 29,2009 @ 7:30AM
Ratings:   -3 +17

Phillip:

Thinking people already know that we are the victims of a BIPARTISAN Ponzi scheme that has been going on for a hundred years. It's called the Federal Reserve.

More to the point today is: have you seen the Dubai crisis? That's us this time next year.

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9. Comment by Phillip D. (pdavid) — November 29,2009 @ 7:33AM
Ratings:   -15 +5

And Obama stepped-up and is attempting to deal with the biggest cause of the increasing deficit, and our number one long term budgetary problem, rising health care costs

Of course the republicans are attempting to make him fail -- way to help the country, republicans!

In fact, they are actively trying to make the deficit worse by extending Bush's tax cuts! Even the CATO Institute, as right-wing as right wing gets, concluded the GOP is not serious about deficit reduction

At least Obama is trying to deal with the deficit. The GOP is just trying to make him fail at every turn, instead of trying to help our country.

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10. Comment by Al S. (rdflyer) — November 29,2009 @ 8:26AM
Ratings:   -3 +12

Who cares how got here. The Blame game is over, and the current has the obligation to solve it!!!!

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11. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 8:32AM
Ratings:   -3 +9

"I will not vote for raising the debt limit without a vehicle to handle this. … This is our moment,"

-- here is a concept, live with the means. Stop trying to buy votes. Both parties are quilty of getting us into this mess.

VOTE ALL INCUMBENTS OUT

SAY NOT TO CAREER POLITICIANS

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12. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 8:35AM
Ratings:   -3 +9

10. Comment by Al S. (rdflyer) — November 29,2009 @ 8:26AM
Ratings: -0 +1

Who cares how got here. The Blame game is over, and the current has the obligation to solve it!!!!

-- Absolutely correct, however the only way to look ahead is to replace them all and start fresh. Our current politicians are too corrupt to change their ways. We need to take the power back to we the people

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13. Comment by Fred B. (whuh) — November 29,2009 @ 9:07AM
Ratings:   -3 +9

#7 Philip -
"the republican Bush is responsible for the current debt"

"And Obama stepped-up and is attempting to deal with the biggest cause of the increasing deficit, and our number one long term budgetary problem, rising health care costs"

Debt and deficit mean specific things. They are not interchangeable.

Obama is responsible for his deficit. Face it.

Regarding the annual Federal deficit and the ongoing debt, to trot out Bush is ridiculous.
They (the Federal Government and our esteemed Representatives) knew at least back in 1995 that Medicare was broke.
And this report from 1999 notes:
"the current and projected cash-flow deficits that have faced the HI program since 1992 deficits that taxpayers will continue to finance through higher taxes, lower spending elsewhere or lower paydowns of publicly held debt than the baseline"

Two-thirds of current spending alrady goes to Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security and Welfaaar...oops Income Security.
Add in interest on the debt of ALL the previous Presidents and you got about a half a trillion to play with for all the other agencies, oh and wars.

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14. Comment by Jay W. (gandalph) — November 29,2009 @ 9:33AM
Ratings:   -7 +5

I find it fascinating that Republicans are now suddenly deficit hawks. Here is a graph by president of the national debt since 1942 as a percentage of the gross domestic product: National Debt History by President

Saint Ronnie tripled the national debt from $1 trillion to $3 trillion and Bush I raised it to $5 trillion then it declined under Clinton. Bush II, not to be outdone by dad, doubled it to $10 trillion. Obviously Republicans have no problem with huge deficits as long as their guy is in the White House.

Now that they want to block everything that Obama tries to do in order to destroy him and get back into power they suddenly get religion about the deficit. Who do they think they are kidding?!

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15. Comment by Peter K. (Sweet Pete) — November 29,2009 @ 11:05AM
Ratings:   -7 +4

#14 - I LOVE pointing out the hypocricy of the GOP on the "spending and smaller government" issues. Bush spent more than all other US Presidents AND increased the number of departments and agencies in the federal government!

Yet they STILL want to pull the wool over the American peoples eyes and say they are "the party of lower spending and smaller government" Ha! Thats a laugh!

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16. Comment by Jack M. (jmcdtucson) — November 29,2009 @ 11:50AM
Ratings:   -0 +3

Will McCain and Kyl back Feinstein's idea? I hope so. We need to live within our means. There is no more pressing issue.

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17. Comment by Alan G. (alang) — November 29,2009 @ 12:53PM
Ratings:   -7 +2

The false notions that Republicans have about the debt and deficit are the reasons why books written people like Savage, Rush, Hannity, Coulter and Palin need to be rounded up and burned. It's for the good of the country that we prevent this misinformation from polluting the minds of the people.

And please, no comparison to Nazis. The Nazis furthered an agenda based on racism and hate. We liberals believe in tolerance, diversity, and fairness.

We believe in doing what's right for the greater good. And it frustrates me to no end that the people don't get it, that they don't know what's best for them.

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18. Comment by Fred B. (whuh) — November 29,2009 @ 12:55PM
Ratings:   -1 +6

14 -
"to $5 trillion then it declined under Clinton"

Actually the deficit declined under Clinton. In his eight years they still added $200B to the debt. He did that by flatlining the Defense Dept budget for eight years, instead of allowing it to grow with the rest of Government spending.
GDP grew in the Clinton years 4%/year.
Federal spending rose 3.7%.
Defense spending went down.

p.s. - the little graph in your link is debt as a percentage of GDP, which is disingenuous and one of the ways the Government gets people to believe it's not a problem.

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19. Comment by George C. (GeorgeCl) — November 29,2009 @ 1:40PM
Ratings:   -2 +7

Don't worry about any comparisons to a minor group that lasted a few years, #17.

The words are straight out of some sort of Communist Manifesto, you know, the guys who murdered at least 100 million Christians and others. 7 million in Ukraine in one winter alone.
But it was all done in the name of the "greater good" so it's ok.

The words make it quite clear how tolerant the Left is.

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20. Comment by George C. (GeorgeCl) — November 29,2009 @ 1:46PM
Ratings:   -2 +7

If anyone Googles "for the greater good" and Communism, you'll see exactly what I mean.

And will one other spokesperson for the Left step up to denounce the proposed book burning? Highly unlikely.

Chilling that the community agitator has so emboldened today's Bolsheviks that they are full-fledged calling for such actions, in public places.

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21. Comment by Richard O. (taicho1) — November 29,2009 @ 1:58PM
Ratings:   -7 +2

Let's see. Democratic President Obama wants to send 31000 troops to Afghanistan. Most democrats are against this but will vote for it. Republicans claim to be conservatives who carefully contral budget spending. But they agree that a million dollars a man is not too much to spend so that the profiteers can make some money on Afghanistan.

I think those of you who consider all politicians as crooks have it right.

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22. Comment by robert j. (forest city) — November 29,2009 @ 2:17PM
Ratings:   -1 +7

#3. Moris
SIMPLETON!

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23. Comment by robert j. (forest city) — November 29,2009 @ 2:20PM
Ratings:   -2 +5

#7. Phillip

Obama and the Dems voted for this crap too! His fingerprints are all over this mess.

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24. Comment by robert j. (forest city) — November 29,2009 @ 2:25PM
Ratings:   -2 +5

#17. Alan G.

Wow!!! Thanks for being sooo smart for all of us IDIOTS.

You are too scary.

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25. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 2:30PM
Ratings:   -0 +5

14. Comment by Jay W.

So you are justifying bad behavior with more bad behavior, then you wonder why we are in this mess??

To think either party cares, is just plain stupid

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26. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 2:34PM
Ratings:   -1 +6

17. "We liberals believe in tolerance, diversity, and fairness."

-- Do you really believe this?? Hard to swallow that pill with the recent bills that were passed recently, you know, the most open and transparent congress. Comments by other liberal concening conservative certainly validates your point???

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27. Comment by Fred B. (whuh) — November 29,2009 @ 2:42PM
Ratings:   -1 +5

24 robert -
"Thanks for being sooo smart for all of us IDIOTS"

But don't you understand ?? It's for the common good that we listen to Alan

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28. Comment by Michael P. (powersmf) — November 29,2009 @ 2:43PM
Ratings:   -2 +6

#7 If you truly believe just one party created this mess, you are living in wonderland.

Dont forget that the democrats controled the purse strings since 2006, they also did not want to address Fannie Mae, believe me Republicans share most of the blame. But each one of our elected officials (535 House and Senate) had a chance correct this mess but chose to accept donations, special interest rates on laon from people that they were suppose to provide oversight, Lastly, we the people have not held these corrupt politicins (both parties) accountable and continued to vote them back into office

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29. Comment by Jay W. (gandalph) — November 29,2009 @ 2:50PM
Ratings:   -6 +0

Comment #17 is an obvious plant, a hoax, to give the righties a straw man to knock down. ROTFLMAO

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30. Comment by James M. (James M. from Tucson) — November 29,2009 @ 3:16PM
Ratings:   -3 +0

NEITHER the 'right' or the 'left' have got it. The founding fathers deliberately left some things out. Like money redistribution. Leave that to PRIVATE industry. It worked real well until FDR decided that private industry could not do this on their own. I don't know but JP Morgan did a great job of this and the Steel moguls did just fine. Look at William Gates the Third. He has done more 'wealth redistribution' than the Fed could ever force him to do. Now, the debt, not the debit (some debit spending is good, like using your credit card to spend and then paying off the entire bill at the end of the month) that will end up destroying this country. Sadly, the solution is not anything that the citizens want. The end of Social Security or seriously curtailing it, the end of Medicare, Medicaid and all othere forms of Socialism will definately reduce the deficit, but the costs are way too high. The same can be said about the Peace Dividend and reducing the size of our Military. The only other solution is to RAISE TAXES, and at a rate that will leave some folks dizzy. However, this will save the Country and get rid of our debt. This is what Clinton started and Shrub killed it. Eight years later, we have a really poor starting position and Obama made it worse. Government meddling in private business is a poor excuse for raising the debt one Trillion Dollars in less than thirty days. Until this is paid back, no further debit spending should be allowed. We have reached the credit limit of the PEOPLE. You, your children, your friends and I are on the hook for almost $40,000 per person and there is no end in sight. Let's start paying back the debt and then think about all of the glorious programs we can have.

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31. Comment by Lee M. (Leeam) — November 29,2009 @ 3:42PM
Ratings:   -1 +6

It is time to vote the whole bunch out of office. If you don't have the money don't spend it. The republicans had their chance to bring things under control and they didn't. The democrats have not intention of bringing things under control. Vote them ALL OUT!

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32. Comment by Rob S. (azrob) — November 29,2009 @ 8:57PM
Ratings:   -0 +2

NO MORE INCREASE OF DEBT!!!!!!
CNN is reporting that we now have over $12 TRILLION in CURRENT debt and over
$100 TRILLION in unfundend promises! This is more money than is in the entire WORLD! Demos--Repubs--STOP IT!!
You're all FIRED!

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33. Comment by Rob S. (azrob) — November 29,2009 @ 9:03PM
Ratings:   -0 +2

Thank you Congress and Presidents for taking us to the "poorhouse"! We will never be able to pay it all back because you had to have your little programs and "earmarks". Next will be the devaluation just like Mexico did a few years ago. Our dollars will be worth 10 cents in the international market. Bread lines--here we come.....

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34. Comment by Fred B. (whuh) — November 29,2009 @ 9:22PM
Ratings:   -0 +1

30 James -
"your friends and I are on the hook for almost $40,000 per person "

Actually it's a lot worse than that.
According to the BLS stats, the workforce is 131 million people.

That's $91,000 per worker.

But of course not everyone makes the same kind of money so...from each according to his means.

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35. Comment by Skip S. (SkooterMan) — November 30,2009 @ 10:22AM
Ratings:   -0 +0

We don't need a debt ceiling, we already have one and it's meaningless.

WE NEED A GOVERNMENT CEILING - about HALF it's current height!!!

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