FORT HOOD, Texas — A key U.S. senator said Sunday that he would begin an investigation into whether the Army missed signs that the man accused of opening fire at Fort Hood had embraced an increasingly extremist view of Islamic ideology.
1. Comment by Jeffrey H. (flibber)— November 9,2009 @ 12:37AM
Ratings:-3+20
fear in the military of being seen as politically incorrect prevented an "intellectually honest discussion of Islamic ideology"
Judeo-Christian religions offer a range of tenets and practices from the most literal and observant to the most accomodating to modern life and thought. Is Islam monolithic or might a reformed version become dominant as reforms in Christianity have become? There really is no honest discussion of Islam and any references in the Koran as to requirement for jihad and treatment of infidels. This newspaper is no exception as to silence on this issue.
3. Comment by John S. (RightsRight)— November 9,2009 @ 5:31AM
Ratings:-4+25
I rarely agree with Leibermann but on this, absolutely. We can't be so PC that when a solder starts talking about extreme acts in the name of whomever we don't address the issue.
5. Comment by J T. (Tuttle)— November 9,2009 @ 5:42AM
Ratings:-4+27
"Dr. Val Finnell said Hasan gave a presentation at the Uniformed Services University that justified suicide bombing and told classmates that Islamic law trumped the U.S. Constitution."
And people have the unmitigated gall to say to not jump to conclusions.
6. Comment by Howard F. (Howwie)— November 9,2009 @ 6:27AM
Ratings:-11+13
Another FOB - Friend of Barack.
7. Comment by francis w. (6565)— November 9,2009 @ 7:14AM
Ratings:-2+25
When, in the history of the US military, have personnel been allowed to openly express agreement with and support for the most heinous policies of their enemies? Political correctness on steroids and it will be the ruination of a once great nation.
9. Comment by sandra f. (azrabbit)— November 9,2009 @ 7:38AM
Ratings:-3+16
#7, Francis:
You got that right. This man is clearly insane, as all mass murderers are, but his ethnicity and his religion precluded us protecting ourselves against his assault. How dumb does that make us?
10. Comment by Patrick O. (tiponeill)— November 9,2009 @ 8:38AM
Ratings:-12+5
Brilliant move - our Jewish senator launching an investigation of Muslims in the military will go a long, long way to helping our troops keep explaining that we aren't on a christian crusade at war with Islam and supporting Israel.
11. Comment by Donald L. (Frodo)— November 9,2009 @ 9:50AM
Ratings:-3+8
Political correctness rules our society - common sense and the rule of law have been thrown out the window.
Complaining in the military is only acted on if political correctness is on your side.
13. Comment by Rich K. (Rich907)— November 9,2009 @ 10:35AM
Ratings:-0+8
Re #10
This is not an investigation of Muslims in the military. It is an investigation into what was known about this guy before he went off and murdered 13 people.
Did people in the military know or suspect enough about this guy that he should have been investigated, and possibly discharged? That is far from an investigation of Muslims. It sounds to me like that is just the sort of investigation that has to take place if we are to avoid a repeat occurrence.
15. Comment by Bruce B. (4262)— November 9,2009 @ 12:10PM
Ratings:-0+8
Patch him up and then give him his military trial. If guilty I would like to see the guy get the maximum penalty according to military justice. An example needs to be set in this case.
17. Comment by C M. (CM6901)— November 9,2009 @ 12:46PM
Ratings:-2+4
Sadly this is nothing but a head hunting mission for this moron's chain of command AND the base chain of command,but ironically the US Army was following the Equal Opportunity laws that were forced on them by our politicians,perhaps,in this time of Islamic extremism,the military should be given a little more say so in who is and isn't eligible to join.
18. Comment by Tom b. (Unhyphenated American)— November 9,2009 @ 1:00PM
Ratings:-1+5
#17 Honestly, this is a think outside of the box type situation. Not exactly following the Army culture. The soldiers that were in his class as he was spouting off his anti-American feelings did the right thing. Unfortunately, I do not think the the leadership knew what to do with him for expressing his anti-American thoughts. Were they going to discharge him for expressing his opinions in a classroom setting? Were they going to start monitoring his emails because of his opinions? He should have at the minimum have been spoken to by his commander to find out if he wanted to even be in the Army after expressing his thoughts. I am not sure how much of a response he would have received other than 'shut up and color' or would he actually been given the opportunity for a discharge? Of course who is to say that even if he would have been given a discharge, that he would not have pulled the same act at a local shopping mall.
19. Comment by C M. (CM6901)— November 9,2009 @ 4:07PM
Ratings:-1+4
18...the military is not high school,college,or a media outlet. You willingly give up some rights,such as free speech,to serve the country. It is a condition that most that wear the uniform understand when they join. As an Iraq veteran,I had my personal thoughts about our involvement there. But I had a job to do (medic) and I did it. Thats the way GI life is. The only order/or self expression I would have ever addressed would have been if I was given an order by whomever my Commander In Chief was,to disarm legal American law abiding citizens.
20. Comment by Mike W. (mwilford)— November 9,2009 @ 4:24PM
Ratings:-3+1
#19, as a 20 year veteran of the military and a commissioned officer, I have to say that you are dead wrong about giving up certain constitutional rights when you join. You don't give up thoses rights at all; you put yourself in check, instead. If you choose to interpret that as giving up your rights, that's all well and good for you, but don't go into a public forum such as this a spread false imformation.
21. Comment by Rich K. (Rich907)— November 9,2009 @ 6:15PM
Ratings:-0+2
Re #14
Your point?
Perhaps it has escaped your attention that the army now acknowledges they knew about contacts between this murderer and a radical Islamic cleric. Just as happened in the case of the attacks on 9/11 it comes out after a terrorist attack that the government knew in advance something was up and sat on its hands. If that does not merit an investigation I don't know what does.
22. Comment by C M. (CM6901)— November 9,2009 @ 6:55PM
Ratings:-0+2
20..you know what I mean...any statement of personal action that makes the military look bad..consider your time over. OK maybe I shouldn't have put it as giving your right up completely,but you and I both now,saying the wrong thing at the wrong time,and your career is over...enlisted soldiers are usually given the General Discharge boots,and if an officer does it,if he isn't forced to resign his commission,he never sees another promotion. Am I wrong for saying that? you know it happens in the world of military politics,
23. Comment by C M. (CM6901)— November 10,2009 @ 12:07AM
Ratings:-0+0
Number 8...what does it matter what type of pistol he used. The FN Five Seven handgun was initially controversial because it had a mild steel core in it's standard round. BATFE declared it a "cop Killer" round so FN went to a lead core. It's a good weapon all around,and if he didn't have a 57 he could have gotten any one of 100's of quality handguns that are available to civilians,Including the Beretta 92 which is the standard US military pistol. The gun can't kill unless there is a person pulling the trigger.
We've added a feature to the comments pages - the ability to easily add paragraph breaks, boldface type and a few other typographical aids to your comments. Launch toolbar
Use single or double carriage returns to put line breaks or paragraph breaks in your comments.
At the same time, we removed the ability to put HTML coding into the comments. People were misusing that feature by pulling in cartoons, photos and other copyrighted materials from publications elsewhere. We won't allow you to use our pages to violate other publications' copyrights.
We've added a story to the site that includes a few tips to resolve common problems. You can use the comment thread attached to that story for practice and testing of the markup tools: Go to story | Go to the practice thread
General Instructions
Welcome to the story comments section of StarNet. Here are some helpful hints with you:
You must be logged in to comment or rate comments. Log in or create an account through our registration system.
All comments are subject to our guidelines (listed below) and our user agreement.
Comment Reporting
You can report other users' comments that are in violation of the StarNet User Guidelines. Users are limited to three (3) reports per day and are not allowed to report their own comments.
Any comment that has been reported will be moderated by StarNet. The comment will either be approved or rejected. Approval or rejection is based solely on the StarNet User Guidelines. Comments are only able to be reported once and are not viewable while awaiting moderation.
If you are a registered site user and are logged in, you can vote thumbs up or thumbs down on the comments.
The total votes of approval and disapproval on that comment will be updated when you vote — including your vote and any other votes that have been cast since your browser last loaded this page.
Votes by users who have been banned from commenting don't count in the totals.
User Guidelines
We welcome your comments on articles, editorials, columns, other topics on StarNet or any subjects important to you. Commentary submitted to StarNet (www.azstarnet.com) may be published or distributed in print, electronically or other forms. Opinions expressed in www.azstarnet.com's comments reflect the opinions of the author, and are not necessarily the opinions of the Star, StarNet, or its parent company. See terms of service for more information.
Our guidelines prohibit the solicitation of products or services, the impersonation of another site user, threatening or harassing postings and the use of vulgar, abusive, obscene or sexually oriented language, defamatory or illegal material. You may not post content that degrades others on the basis of gender, race, class, ethnicity, national origin, religion, sexual preference, disability or other classification. It's fine to criticize ideas, but ad hominem attacks are prohibited. Users who violate those standards may lose their privileges on azstarnet.com.
Don't violate other publications' copyrights.
Do we edit user comments? No. The writers are responsible for the opinions they express and the accuracy of the information they provide. StarNet reserves the right to remove comments that violate our guidelines policy.
Senator will investigate Army's view of Hasan
FORT HOOD, Texas — A key U.S. senator said Sunday that he would begin an investigation into whether the Army missed signs that the man accused of opening fire at Fort Hood had embraced an increasingly extremist view of Islamic ideology.fear in the military of being seen as politically incorrect prevented an "intellectually honest discussion of Islamic ideology"
Judeo-Christian religions offer a range of tenets and practices from the most literal and observant to the most accomodating to modern life and thought. Is Islam monolithic or might a reformed version become dominant as reforms in Christianity have become? There really is no honest discussion of Islam and any references in the Koran as to requirement for jihad and treatment of infidels. This newspaper is no exception as to silence on this issue.
Report this comment
Just discharge the 3000 US Muslim soldiers in the military and be done with it.
Report this comment
I rarely agree with Leibermann but on this, absolutely. We can't be so PC that when a solder starts talking about extreme acts in the name of whomever we don't address the issue.
Report this comment
Talk about history repeating itself.
What about the Japanese Americans during world war II? They lost their property and were herded into camps for the families.
Yet the Japanese American regiment was the most decorated in world war II.
This man was a terrorist. I dought that a major was hassled by enlisted personnell. He was crazy and he didnt want to remain in the service.
But that doesn't mean that all Muslims are terrorist or traitors.
Report this comment
"Dr. Val Finnell said Hasan gave a presentation at the Uniformed Services University that justified suicide bombing and told classmates that Islamic law trumped the U.S. Constitution."
And people have the unmitigated gall to say to not jump to conclusions.
Idiots!
Report this comment
Another FOB - Friend of Barack.
When, in the history of the US military, have personnel been allowed to openly express agreement with and support for the most heinous policies of their enemies? Political correctness on steroids and it will be the ruination of a once great nation.
Report this comment
Why nothing in the Star about this part of the story?
'Cop Killer' Gun Used In Ft. Hood Shooting, Officials Said
The gun thought to be used in the Fort Hood massacre packs so much firepower, it's known as 'the Cop Killer,' federal law enforcement officials said.
Report this comment
#7, Francis:
You got that right. This man is clearly insane, as all mass murderers are, but his ethnicity and his religion precluded us protecting ourselves against his assault. How dumb does that make us?
Report this comment
Brilliant move - our Jewish senator launching an investigation of Muslims in the military will go a long, long way to helping our troops keep explaining that we aren't on a christian crusade at war with Islam and supporting Israel.
Report this comment
Political correctness rules our society - common sense and the rule of law have been thrown out the window.
Complaining in the military is only acted on if political correctness is on your side.
Report this comment
Personally, I find it ironic that Lieberman is leading the investigation. And where are his two amigos, John McCain and Lindsey Graham?
Report this comment
Re #10
This is not an investigation of Muslims in the military. It is an investigation into what was known about this guy before he went off and murdered 13 people.
Did people in the military know or suspect enough about this guy that he should have been investigated, and possibly discharged? That is far from an investigation of Muslims. It sounds to me like that is just the sort of investigation that has to take place if we are to avoid a repeat occurrence.
Report this comment
13 - "This is not an investigation of Muslims in the military."
I am sure that the people of Afghanistan will see it that way.
Report this comment
Patch him up and then give him his military trial. If guilty I would like to see the guy get the maximum penalty according to military justice. An example needs to be set in this case.
Report this comment
Joe, just let the Army do their job. No need to grandstand right now.
Report this comment
Sadly this is nothing but a head hunting mission for this moron's chain of command AND the base chain of command,but ironically the US Army was following the Equal Opportunity laws that were forced on them by our politicians,perhaps,in this time of Islamic extremism,the military should be given a little more say so in who is and isn't eligible to join.
Report this comment
#17 Honestly, this is a think outside of the box type situation. Not exactly following the Army culture. The soldiers that were in his class as he was spouting off his anti-American feelings did the right thing. Unfortunately, I do not think the the leadership knew what to do with him for expressing his anti-American thoughts. Were they going to discharge him for expressing his opinions in a classroom setting? Were they going to start monitoring his emails because of his opinions? He should have at the minimum have been spoken to by his commander to find out if he wanted to even be in the Army after expressing his thoughts. I am not sure how much of a response he would have received other than 'shut up and color' or would he actually been given the opportunity for a discharge? Of course who is to say that even if he would have been given a discharge, that he would not have pulled the same act at a local shopping mall.
Report this comment
18...the military is not high school,college,or a media outlet. You willingly give up some rights,such as free speech,to serve the country. It is a condition that most that wear the uniform understand when they join. As an Iraq veteran,I had my personal thoughts about our involvement there. But I had a job to do (medic) and I did it. Thats the way GI life is. The only order/or self expression I would have ever addressed would have been if I was given an order by whomever my Commander In Chief was,to disarm legal American law abiding citizens.
Report this comment
#19, as a 20 year veteran of the military and a commissioned officer, I have to say that you are dead wrong about giving up certain constitutional rights when you join. You don't give up thoses rights at all; you put yourself in check, instead. If you choose to interpret that as giving up your rights, that's all well and good for you, but don't go into a public forum such as this a spread false imformation.
Report this comment
Re #14
Your point?
Perhaps it has escaped your attention that the army now acknowledges they knew about contacts between this murderer and a radical Islamic cleric. Just as happened in the case of the attacks on 9/11 it comes out after a terrorist attack that the government knew in advance something was up and sat on its hands. If that does not merit an investigation I don't know what does.
Report this comment
20..you know what I mean...any statement of personal action that makes the military look bad..consider your time over. OK maybe I shouldn't have put it as giving your right up completely,but you and I both now,saying the wrong thing at the wrong time,and your career is over...enlisted soldiers are usually given the General Discharge boots,and if an officer does it,if he isn't forced to resign his commission,he never sees another promotion. Am I wrong for saying that? you know it happens in the world of military politics,
Report this comment
Number 8...what does it matter what type of pistol he used. The FN Five Seven handgun was initially controversial because it had a mild steel core in it's standard round. BATFE declared it a "cop Killer" round so FN went to a lead core. It's a good weapon all around,and if he didn't have a 57 he could have gotten any one of 100's of quality handguns that are available to civilians,Including the Beretta 92 which is the standard US military pistol. The gun can't kill unless there is a person pulling the trigger.
Report this comment